Advice for potential new Keyholders

Angelina

Christine If Jane doesn't like it, she can always move out.

sounds a bit strange. weren't you in the belt for exactly that reason? because you couldn't financially afford to move out? I think Jane has a similar problem

Renita Right. We don't know the details of the deal

maybe @Jenna and @Susan know more?

Jenna

I did a "check in" with Monica over the weekend. Things have been a bit strained between her and Jane over the last few weeks. Monica had been withholding the use of Jane's car, and was not giving her any money. She was not happy that Jane was continuing to have sex, apparently with some boy from her old school.

Monica made it clear that kicking Jane out of the house was out of the question. The two of them did sit down over this past weekend and tried to work out a new deal. Jane had to wear the belt on nights when she left the house, and on weekends, and in return she could have her car back and be given money by her mother.

This sounds much like the old deal. I told her to call me anytime.

Sara

Jenna Isn't this just going to lead to the same outcome? Wouldn't it be better to set expectations that it should always be on unless there is a good reason for it not to be?

I also think that it is totally fine to just move on and consider it an idea that didn't work; After all this is about Jane and as long as she recognizes what happened, she is probably in the best position to figure out a plan to make sure she doesn't repeat the same mistakes.

Kaja

Sara Why? I think that wear it 24/7 is usseles. Use it only at risk moments and you will be safe and more comfy.

Sasha

Sara Until something bad happens she will never accept there’s a problem and work towards a solution. And unfortunately, her mother really can’t offer much there either until that point

Jenna

Sara My preference is for 24/7 wearing, but I do not think such an outcome is possible in this situation. Jane will not agree that this is in her long-term best interests. The best that can be hoped for, in my opinion, is Jane to wear it whenever situations may lead to sexual transgressions, which seems to be whenever she leaves the house.

I don't think Monica wants to give up on the idea as she believes that this is the best way to prevent Jane from continuing to make the same mistakes over and over. There are deeper issues at play here, including broken trust that goes back many years I think. The belt in my opinion is not a perfect solution, but could help them to sort things out until they can address the root of their issues.

Jenna

Kaja This is one of the few times I would agree with you. 24/7 is out of the question here. But wear outside of the house is absolutely appropriate.

Sasha

Jenna The belt in my opinion is not a perfect solution, but could help them to sort things out until they can address the root of their issues.

Unfortunately that’s incorrect. Spent a few months in total in various levels of detention, you’d think would be enough to get the message right? But even when I got to the point of wanting out, it wasn’t. Just another inconvenience to me, another thing I needed to figure out how to get around.
Because why change? I’ll be out in a few days. Wasn’t till something bad happened that I knew I had to. Jane will learn the same way most likely, just hope she can recover from it

youdontknowme

Sasha The way I see it, she sees the belt not as a way towards solving what she sees as a problem, but as a symptomatic treatment until the underlying issues have been solved in another way. Like hanging a picture over a crack in the wall - it does not make the crack go away, but it makes the room look a bit more intact until someone figures out a way to patch that crack.

Sasha

youdontknowme I believe you’re correct, and if she can get her to wear it, probably going to make the overall situation worse.
And even if she finds the better solution, without her accepting it there’s no hope for it.
Of course she needs to try, it’s just watching this from the outside, I’ve seen this road before and I know where it goes

youdontknowme

Sasha It feels to me as if Monica is very concerned about appearances, and will be eager to pursue solutions that quickly yield superficial results. My concern is that exactly what you mention, that by covering up the problem she will make it harder to find a proper, fundamental and lasting solution.

Jenna

Sasha I have an enormous advantage over Monica in that I have 2 girls who love and respect me, so while initially difficult in selling them on advantages of wearing a belt, I ultimately succeeded in getting them to understand their value and importance.

Monica and Jane have had many years of distrust between them and getting Jane to move forward on a radical step like this has been difficult indeed. Rational dialogue between them is all but impossible.

Jenna

youdontknowme I would wholeheartedly agree with you here. Jane is behaving like a slut and there is a certain amount of embarrassment felt by Monica once a bunch of her peers found out about it. The belt will help minimize and hopefully eliminate these possibilities while the search for understanding Jane's underlying actions can be diagnosed and dealt with.

youdontknowme

Jenna While my own choice of words would be very different from yours, I feel like this is an excellent example of respectful disagreement. You, Sasha and I have very different views on the issue, so we approach the subject matter with very different value systems, experiences and perspectives in mind. But instead of focussing on the differences in our premises, this post highlights the commonalities of the conclusion: That the best-case result is that this arrangement buys the two time to resolve their differences and figure out a way forward (with the worst case being that it drives them apart further). I think it is a great idea to have Susan be the one to do the talking with Jane, so that Jane has someone who is closer to being her peer than Monica's.

Jenna I have an enormous advantage over Monica in that I have 2 girls who love and respect me, so while initially difficult in selling them on advantages of wearing a belt, I ultimately succeeded in getting them to understand their value and importance.

And I have to appreciate you for taking the effort to work with them, rather than against them, on this matter. For, at least as far as I can tell as a casual observer, navigating this dangerous situation of a power imbalance and making sure that the arrangement you have is upheld by mutual respect, not coercion.

Kaja

Jenna The problem is that boys that do the same are "cool" but girls are "dirty" and "sluts". This is problem, not what Jane does.

Kaja

Jenna Chastity belt is not a solution. It will be only worse. This girls ussualy have problems with confidence and self love (or they just like sex - and it is not bad).
The solution is work with her mind, she must know that her personality is important, that she is not piece of meat. No, chastity will make it worse.

Jenna

youdontknowme 100% agree, that is why you will not see me shy away from difficult questions and except for one person here I will respond to everyone. I have not and would not speak with Jane directly unless Monica specifically asked me too, and even then I would want her (Monica) to be present. I agree it is important to have a two track communication system with them with Susan speaking to Jane, as she does do. As much as i was reluctant to get involved, I am OK with it now as these are two people that need help. We will do as much as we can.

youdontknowme And I have to appreciate you for taking the effort to work with them, rather than against them, on this matter. For, at least as far as I can tell as a casual observer, navigating this dangerous situation of a power imbalance and making sure that the arrangement you have is upheld by mutual respect, not coercion.

I appreciate your acknowledgement of this. I fully realize that what I am asking of the girls is a lot, they know I know that. We are at the point we are through much dialogue, and many tears as well, but an understanding that this is a path worth going down (and one that also has an exit too). It is hard for me to shake the "coercion" label, and I understand that. The girls know I love them no matter what and always have their best interests at heart.

youdontknowme

Jenna It is hard for me to shake the "coercion" label, and I understand that.

That is the nature of your relationship. There is a natural power imbalance that makes consent hard to navigate. Which is why I am happy that you point out the presence of exits on the path. Also, thanks for your candid words about what went on in your family, that glimpse into the decision you found yourself making has definitely made me more confident that the arrangement with your nieces is founded in mutual respect and consent.

Jenna

youdontknowme Thank you. I started out on a rocky road when I first joined, but I believe most of the people here come from a good place and want to be helpful. Indeed I have found such help and the girls have too. I was reluctant to have them join at first, but am glad they did. They know that there are others out there who wear them too, and do it successfully.

Our "exit ramp" agreement is a reminder that I need to take care of their needs both emotionally and otherwise lest I lose sight of why we are doing this. The girls know I am committed to this and I think by doing so they are committed too.

Jenna

Kaja I may agree with you about their being a double standard about boys and girls that engage in the same activity. Jane's behavior though with one person in particular, and also the amount of partners she has had is indeed shameful.

Sara

Kaja I always appreciate your perspective, but I think you are oversimplifying.

My only and older brother had a problem keeping his penis in his pants and I'm sure that my parents would have liked a Chastity belt to help keep it where it belongs. He was lucky in that he didn't end up becoming a daddy at 17 or 18 only because his pregnant girlfriend happened to become impregnated by someone else.

That being said he also only dated age appropriate women who were apart of his social circle. Jane doesn't have the sense to do that so this goes well beyond a normal or healthy relationship. It's easy to simplify this as 'Jane is a slut', but that's not really the issue at hand, it's more about her inability to do anything but find toxic relationships.

A Chastity belt seems like it would be a good solution in that it doesn't prevent her from engaging in the things she enjoys compared to her parents not letting her go out at all. The belt protects Jane while keeping away toxic men who are only interested in Jane as an object.

My advice wasn't meant as 'Jane is a slut', she shouldn't be allowed to have an orgasm, it is more about it you are going to wear a chastity belt it needs to be on by default so that you build up confidence wearing it so that it is there when you need it. I'm sure Monica wouldn't have a problem with Jane having some alone time, the idea is more about changing the mindset from "you need to be punished if you want to engage in these activities" to "do you think that this activity is a good reason not to wear protection?".

Jenna

Kaja You may be right here, but Monica wants this slutty behavior to stop and wearing a belt will help in that regard.

WriterAlexis

Jenna

the amount of partners she has had is indeed shameful.

Why is it shameful?

Kaja

Jenna It is not shameful. You think that it is shameful. And its important different.
Therebis nothing wrong on it if she likes sex, if she wants sex, is she has sex.

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