Marder Which is why you would be a good moderator.

no, i want to keep the freedom to be uncomfortable sometimes 😂

Joh I got the information the requirement can Not fulfilled from a man. But @Laura should Tell us.

well, actually you were one of the first candidates i had in mind when i wrote that, because you can understand different positions, what would @Laura say?

plaidtoad How about everyone who participates moderate themselves.

theoretically you're right, i don't think we need anyone to crack down too hard either. my main concern is that someone sets a limit when it comes to violent arguments among users in order to maintain a peaceful climate

  • Joh likes this.

        Joh why is the server in USA? Most slightly sketchy sites are not hosted in USA.

            PigtailSam why is the server in USA?

            What's wrong with it?

              PigtailSam I think that is beaus @Laura runs the server and she is in the US. That said, for a site like this the US's fairly absolutist view of free speech is probably better protection than the lack of enforcement that the sites you are talking about rely on.

                • Joh

                  • Post #21

                  PigtailSam It doesn't mater where the server are to point out the problem with his argument is. And frankly speaking I don't know where the server is.

                    @curious

                    as far as the legal risk is concerned, i would rather say it lies with the administrators, i see no risk with moderators

                    anyway, @Joh you seem to be the only one who is interested, would you be willing to do it and @Laura would you accept it?

                      Angelina far

                      Angelina as far as the legal risk is concerned, i would rather say it lies with the administrators, i see no risk with moderators

                      Especially in Germany the risk is valid for moderators as well.
                      In German law there is that weird concept of 'Störerhaftung'. Essentially, if there is something German prosecutors consider illegal here and as moderator you are able to remove that but don't do it, you can be charged with passively supporting that what you have not acted upon and removed.
                      Usually prosecutors would target the owner, but if she is out of reach and moderators fall under German jurisdiction, guess what they might do.
                      Maybe ultimately you would win arguing freedom of speech, but it could be a very long case through multiple levels of courts and being a moderator is not worth the risk.

                            curious

                            The US actually has some of the strongest protections in place for these situations. Companies were being hit with frivolous lawsuits in attempting to moderate content, while the "Wild West" approach was letting them off scot-free. This was making the internet far more offensive and obscene (and more importantly reducing the revenue of advertisers.) So bipartisan lawmakers under pressure from their corporate puppetmasters crafted the 1996 Communications Decency Act which holds that wesites not responsible for what their users post.

                            https://www.npr.org/2023/02/21/1157683233/supreme-court-google-twitter-section-230

                            There is quite a robust debate in this country on whether or not Section 230 of the 1996 Communications Decency Act should be abolished or amended.

                                What are the expected duties and responsibilities of a moderator here?

                                WriterAlexis
                                I am well awate that free speech in the US has a legal standing that makes it pretty much impossible to go after forum owners or moderators.
                                But @Joh is, according to his profile, from Germany and legal standards there are different.
                                He would have significant legal exposure as moderator, so that warning stands.

                                    Angelina anyway, @Joh you seem to be the only one who is interested, would you be willing to do it and @Laura would you accept it?

                                    @Laue and I would first have to talk about her expectations and my tasks with framework conditions. If we come to a common denominator, I would be willing to do it.

                                        curious Out of curiosity, is this a theoretical concern, or is it something German prosecutors have actually done in the past?

                                            curious But @Joh is, according to his profile, from Germany and legal standards there are different.
                                            He would have significant legal exposure as moderator, so that warning stands.

                                            Thank you for your concern but in the end I have to decide how high will be the risk and how likely will it be that a German government organisation will contact me.

                                              pestulens
                                              This principle of 'Störerhaftung' has been used many times, though in other context.
                                              When you open your wifi in Germany as a private person and someone else used this open wifi for things illegal in Germany (even something rather harmless than file sharing of copyrighted material, the owner of that wifi point is held liable. Even if he can proof that it was not he who actually did the file sharing. Not protecting your wifi against abuse leads to being held resonsonsible for what other people do with it.
                                              Same thing for people running discussion boards. And it is easy to see that if the owner is out of reach authorities will go after the next best target - moderators - if they can.

                                                  Joh
                                                  You are aware that you leave a trace wherever you go online? You have an email address with a German ISP. They certainly have records about the IP addresses that accessed the account which leads to your mobile or Internet carrier who has records which IP your device had at any given time.
                                                  Easy enough to identify someone when you can access those information.

                                                    curious Maybe ultimately you would win arguing freedom of speech,

                                                    i would rather say the moderator would win because he can't be held responsible because he has no rights to the forum, this is the sole responsibility of the owner. a moderator is not responsible to the outside world but only has to work internally to enforce the rules of the forum. to be clear, if illegal content is posted a moderator can't be held responsible if it would be allowed under the rules of the forum

                                                    curious He would have significant legal exposure as moderator, so that warning stands.

                                                    but we are not a german forum, so the legal situation in germany is irrelevant

                                                    Joh @Laue and I would first have to talk about her expectations and my tasks with framework conditions. If we come to a common denominator, I would be willing to do it.

                                                    @Laura what do you think? in the end you have to decide

                                                    curious Not protecting your wifi against abuse leads to being held resonsonsible for what other people do with it.

                                                    ok, now i want to see proof of that. then theoretically it would be possible that i, as the owner of our wifi, would be responsible if my wife did illegal things on the internet?

                                                              Angelina @Laura what do you think? in the end you have to decide

                                                              I need someone who has enough time and without risk. I don't know German laws

                                                                  Angelina Countries like to maintain control over their citizens and do what they can to prevent their citizens from shpping for more favorable jurisdictions. If they truly want to combat what gets posted on this site, they will go after any person with a shred of responsibility they can get their hands on, whether you or I feel that is justified or not.

                                                                  This can have some unforeseen results, like when an 18-year-old British boy was planning to visit his slightly younger long-distant boyfriend in France and was at risk of falling afoul of British sex tourism laws, created with the idea of middle-aged men buying an underage hooker's services in some small island country, despite French age-of-consent laws being met and the couple's relationship being that of a loving, enthusiastically consenting couple.

                                                                  For a more recent and visible example, see the EU's attempts to enforce GDPR compliance on US-run sites.

                                                                  That said, I believe curious is also overestimating the exposure a bit. Sure, ISPs can see that you are interacting with the site, but that is about all the info that can be gotten out of them. You need access to UWC's servers to do much more, and while that certainly is possible, authorities have bigger fish to fry than going through that effort to go after a place that has nothing more problematic than misterpoll.