Sara2001 I wouldn't say that I am in a sm relationship. I am not in a relationship with equal rights, so I disagree in this point. But I am in a consensual relationship where I agreed (and still do) to have less rights and to be kept belted. Beside this, I can agree.

But I think what we do has almost nothing in common with SM. SM is mostly a sex game.

Sadomasochism is not a fully defined concept, so everyone can understand it differently. Personally, in the context of typical consensual play, I usually use the term "BDSM". Sadomasochism has a broader (medical) meaning for me, including situations where there is a hierarchical relationship of a sexual or quasi-sexual nature between two unequal parties, one dominant and the other subordinate. Both the DSM-5 classification and (no longer valid) ICD-10 exclude "classic" BDSM from the spectrum of sadomasochism for the purposes of diagnosis.

      Andrew Both the DSM-5 classification and (no longer valid) ICD-10 exclude "classic" BDSM from the spectrum of sadomasochism for the purposes of diagnosis.

      Actually, both masochism and sadism are still part of medical diagnostic standards, but today there is one critical element that must be present for this diagnosis to actually apply: the person must feel that he/she is actually suffering from having these feelings. If you have either masochistic or sadistic urges but are completely fine with that, the medical diagnosis criteria are not met.

          Angelina I would never suggest it to my daughter, but talking about it is not a crime, what my daughter does with the information would remain her own decision

          You want to tell your daughter, you were abused by your father? This may distroy the relationship between your (future) daughter and her grandpa. She may be scared of him afterwards. Better you wait till she is an adult. Othewise she may fear having to wear a chastity belt, too.

              Ines The truth is sometimes hard, sorry. It has nothing to do with being impolite. We talk about masturbation and the role of the keyholders is important. I'm sure nobody without a dominant vein becomes a keyholder by indroducing a chastity belt into the family.

                  Andrew I think one example (@Angelina) that doesn't match would show you, your theory isn't perfect (but definitely appropriate in some cases). In physics you need only one negative example to break a theory. Comming from a technical background, I often argue like this. Of course, this doesn't have to be the case everywhere.
                  Some girls don't like the belt but the power imbalance was in the beginning so huge that they couldn't reject the atempt. If @Angelina 's story is true, so is her.
                  I think if the power imbalance or the brainwashing is intensive enough, everybody can be talked into a chastity belt. This is my problem with this kind of families and especially the keyholders.

                      a_father The truth is sometimes hard, sorry.

                      No, it only is when someone insists on being inconsiderate.
                      The "truth" in most cases, except a few, can be replaced by "your opinion."

                      Apart from that, your words in your last post are acceptable, not in the previous one, proof that, when you want to, you are even capable of speaking like a normal person.

                      Keep this tone in the future. Thank you.

                        curious Actually, both masochism and sadism are still part of medical diagnostic standards, but today there is one critical element that must be present for this diagnosis to actually apply: the person must feel that he/she is actually suffering from having these feelings. If you have either masochistic or sadistic urges but are completely fine with that, the medical diagnosis criteria are not met.

                        Regarding masochism. What you write applies under the DSM-5. Masochism is no longer a disorder according to ICD-11. From the old category of "sadomasochism" (in ICD-10), only "Coercive Sexual Sadism Disorder" is left (code 6D33 in ICD-11).

                        As for sadism, it can be diagnosed in both classifications not only if it disturbs the person, but also if he or she takes actions under the influence of this disorder that pose a threat to other people (this applies mainly to sex offenders).

                        a_father I think one example (@Angelina) that doesn't match would show you, your theory isn't perfect (but definitely appropriate in some cases).

                        First, I clearly wrote that it is a HYPOTHESIS, that is, something that can be confirmed or disproved. Secondly, I pointed out that it concerns the "large part of the girls on the forum", not "all" or even "the majority". You, on the other hand, provided a good argument against my hypothesis, for which I am grateful. 😁

                            curious Actually, both masochism and sadism are still part of medical diagnostic standards, but today there is one critical element that must be present for this diagnosis to actually apply: the person must feel that he/she is actually suffering from having these feelings. If you have either masochistic or sadistic urges but are completely fine with that, the medical diagnosis criteria are not met.

                            Do I understand it right. If a person doesn't suffer under e.g spanking, the person is no masochist?

                                Joh
                                Not in a medical way where "masochism" is then defined as a treatable disorder.
                                And it is not about suffering under spanking. It is about the mental suffering from having these urges which make it either a medical condition that should be treated or just your personal sexual preference.

                                So unlike many years ago, where doctors could say "oh, you like to be spanked, well, that makes you a masochist and you should get treated for this", today it is actually the patient himself/herself who decides if he/she is suffering from a mental illness called masochism and requests treatment or not.

                                    curious Ok. If someone has no mental illness, he/she is healthy and can live happily ever after.
                                    Is he/she a masochist or not if it is not seen from the medical point of view?

                                    • Ines replied to this.

                                        Joh
                                        It is a paraphilia, but sometimes is linked with psychiatric diseases, as psycopathy.
                                        Then, it is a problem.

                                          Avery she now suggests she is going to expose her daughter to the same

                                          no, that's just not true, i wpuldn't suggest my daughter to wear a belt, i would never do that, i'm just saying that i wouldn't forbid her to either

                                          Avery It is the father that must not cross the boundary.

                                          yes, my father crossed a line because he (psychologically) forced me to do it, but that doesn't apply to my later children)

                                          Andrew If you felt offended by my reasoning, I am very sorry.

                                          I don't feel attacked, I find it interesting. I don't agree with that, but I would be interested to know why some users think that

                                          a_father You want to tell your daughter, you were abused by your father? This may distroy the relationship between your (future) daughter and her grandpa. She may be scared of him afterwards. Better you wait till she is an adult. Othewise she may fear having to wear a chastity belt, too.

                                          not even that. I try to explain it. There will come an age when my (hypothetical) daughter will begin to develop her sexuality. Of course she is allowed to masturbate and hopefully she will find a nice partner with whom she will have her first sex. I just want to show her and describe objectively how it was for me and why it was like that and what advantages and disadvantages it brought. Of course I don't want to influence you, but it should be possible to talk about it

                                                    Angelina I just want to show her and describe objectively how it was for me

                                                    Don't do that. You can't imagine how weired this would be for her. You live in an absolut parallel world now. When you are free for a while an look back you'll understand. Perhapse you even want to talk with the athorities about what happened to you.
                                                    For you I hope your girfriend is the right partner for life and the marriage is not driven be the abuse of your father. You had no chance to develop your sexuality in a normal way. I hope you don't become the victom of your father for a second time.

                                                        a_father You can't imagine how weired this would be for her.

                                                        i can do that, i found it totally strange myself when i found out about it, that it existed. for me it was something from the middle ages or a toy. i don't want to harm my daughter, but the day will come when she might ask what my sex life was like in my teens or young adulthood and i would like to be honest in such an important conversation.

                                                            a_father Don't do that. You can't imagine how weird this would be for her. You live in an absolute parallel world now. When you are free for a while and look back you'll understand. Perhaps you even want to talk with the authorities about what happened to you.
                                                            For you I hope your girlfriend is the right partner for life and the marriage is not driven by the abuse of your father. You had no chance to develop your sexuality in a normal way. I hope you don't become the victim of your father for a second time.

                                                            If there are nominations for "post of the year" this one gets my vote. Lots of wisdom and good advice in there. Excellent.

                                                              a_father
                                                              I would be more careful to apply your views and generalise everything.
                                                              Take corporal punishment as an example. 100 years ago, children got routinely spanked for misbehaving, not only at home but also in school.
                                                              Today we consider that inappropriate, but it was completely normal to our grandparents.
                                                              And surprise, surprise, most of our grandparents actually did not feel like 'victims of physical abuse' or were emotionally traumatised for life.

                                                              In other words:
                                                              There are many ways to bring up children. And to so
                                                              me people chastity is part of how they do that. What is wrong in your views might be desirable in someone else's view.
                                                              Constantly harping about how wrong everyone is who is not in line with what you consider right is not a good thing. Angelina for example has expressed on multiple occasions that while she does not like to wear the belt, she ultimately is accepting her father's authority in that matter. And based on her rather self conscious and intelligent way to communicate, I doubt that she will be temotionally raumatised or needing psychological treatment from having been kept in chastity until her wedding.

                                                                  curious harping about how wrong everyone is who is not in line with what you consider right is not a good thing.

                                                                  Stop doing it then.

                                                                    curious And surprise, surprise, most of our grandparents actually did not feel like 'victims of physical abuse' or were emotionally traumatised for life.

                                                                    It was shown that children who were beaten up later beat up their own children. Even if there is no obvious trauma, it leaves deep traces. For this reason, it is now forbidden by law in Germany. § 1631 BGB, § 225 StBG

                                                                      a_father the current weares would suggest their future daughters to wear a chastity belt

                                                                      And some even wants to force their daughters to wear a belt despite being an involuntarily wearer at first time, according to poll here. This kind of shows negative cycles...

                                                                      Personally I won't let my daughter, if I have any in future, to wear a chastity belt even if she asks me for one, until she becomes an adult and either decide that with her partner or she wants it for herself. I won't become a keyholder of my daughter, period.

                                                                          curious Actually, both masochism and sadism are still part of medical diagnostic standards, but today there is one critical element that must be present for this diagnosis to actually apply: the person must feel that he/she is actually suffering from having these feelings. If you have either masochistic or sadistic urges but are completely fine with that, the medical diagnosis criteria are not met.

                                                                          My husband is not a sadist, I am not a masochist. Non of us is enjoying discipline. We enjoy hierarchy and structure. Discipline is a tool, not a purpose.