George Religion is getting politicized in the USA, by the conservatives.

Conservatives seem to politicize religion everywhere, as it is a key reference point for them as a source of values.

George church tax that the Nazis introduced, but somehow never got canceled

When Polish guest workers traveled to Germany, at first they usually declared their affiliation with the Catholic Church, but when they found out that they would be charged church tax by doing so, they momentarily "lost faith." The German church took revenge by sending information to Poland that such a person had apostasized, so the Polish episcopate had to introduce a regulation that apostasies made abroad would not be recognized. 😉

youdontknowme I think above all, religious matters are getting more divisive in America, while they seem to be getting more harmonious in western central Europe.

In the U.S. - especially in Protestant circles - there is much greater religious fervor than in Europe. Churches in the US are also completely separate from the state, making them more resistant to secularization.

          Andrew The German church took revenge by sending information to Poland that such a person had apostasized, so the Polish episcopate had to introduce a regulation that apostasies made abroad would not be recognized.

          If only, for getting someone a Catholic funeral in Poland, you need a confirmation from their Austrian parish that they've been active members of the parish and attended regularly mess.

          Guess we missed this regulation, or it only applies to the living who still can give.

          Did I mention that my parents are very "good" Catholics. (Which did not keep them from allocating my girlfriends to one of the guest rooms, letting them know that the room is well sound proofed, where the condoms are, and that they know how to answer inquisitive questions from their parents. Very catholic 😀 )

          With such "good" Catholics as parents, I've managed to raise me as a very pragmatic atheist 😀

              George they've been active members of the parish and attended regularly mess.

              Amusing mistranslation here. Either that or mass is very disorganized in Austria.

                  youdontknowme No, I don't use a translator, so it's just a typo 😅

                  And yes Austrian Church is quite a bit more relaxed than Polish Church. The only thing less relaxed is church tax collection.

                    youdontknowme I reckon that as a liberal German, you probably spend more time without clothes than an American from a Mormon family.

                    that may be, of course, but i still maintain that it would probably have frustrated me even more if i had been able to see my private parts all the time.

                        youdontknowme I reckon that as a liberal German, you probably spend more time without clothes than an American from a Mormon family.

                        Probably correct, but I doubt the Mormon fathers watch their daughters shower.

                            George Which did not keep them from allocating my girlfriends to one of the guest rooms, letting them know that the room is well sound proofed, where the condoms are, and that they know how to answer inquisitive questions from their parents. Very catholic

                            I would say exemplarily Catholic. Probably no other religion can so perfectly combine such contradictions between teaching and the practice of everyday life.

                                Andrew I haven't seen it like that 😁

                                Interesting point of view.

                                  Avery Probably correct, but I doubt the Mormon fathers watch their daughters shower.

                                  Exactly, well said. Girls have right to intimacy, and even on a strict point of view, some minutes of intimacy do not collide with safety.
                                  It is OK do not allow long showers without the belt, but to spy daughters is a madness in my value scale.

                                      George I've managed to raise me as a very pragmatic atheist

                                      Why not be a pragmatic Catholic. Boston College, a Jesuit institution, forbids the distribution on campus of condoms. So the Boston College Students for Sexual Health (BCSSH), an independent organization, sets up a table outside of McElroy Commons (the student center) on the corner of College Road, a city street, city property, and distributes condoms. The priests have done their duty and so has BCSSH. The only people who lose might be students who believe a condom is adequate protection (against pregnancy, not venerial disease).

                                          Angelina it would probably have frustrated me even more if i had been able to see my private parts all the time.

                                          I have to agree with this, even wearing voluntarily, being able to see it like that would drive me nuts

                                            Huh. This is an interesting consensus forming. Guess I'm an outlier.

                                              WriterAlexis Coming from another walk of life.

                                              And your positions are for Americans rather extreme.

                                              Avery Why not be a pragmatic Catholic

                                              Well to be more precise, I probably tend most to somewhere between atheist and agnostic. And what could be called "social Catholic" (potentially practicing some of the rituals but not for the religious but the social relevancy). Arguably that is a form of "pragmatic Catholic" too.

                                                    George potentially practicing some of the rituals

                                                    Personally, I drive over to the church and sit in my car and pray to each of the three statues. Also enter the church on sunny Sundays before people arrive and pray there.

                                                      WriterAlexis I suggest choosing wisely, and considering emigrating to Europe.

                                                      You know a nice place where religion is mostly, well religion. Not something that generally controls your life.

                                                      It's one of my personal jokes, I personally don't have a problem with Muslims. Not the boogeyman our right wing populist try to make them. But then all the ones I know personally, practice their faith about as intensely as I do with my Catholicism.

                                                      The most fundamentalist Muslim we've known personally was school friend of the kids. No she did not dress differently from the kids, 2nd generation Austrian anyway, but a small rebel, she insisted on trying to keep the diet (her idea, not her parents, which quietly rolled the eyes), so we made sure to have pork free stuff available when she visited. 🤷

                                                      That's the kind how religion should interfere with your life, IMHO, and not an inch further, @WriterAlexis

                                                          George I personally don't Muslims.

                                                          Err... this sentence no verb?

                                                          But yeah, I am very much a proponent of the religion-as-a-penis rule. It is fine to have one, fine to not have one, fine to be proud of the one you have. But don't wave it in people's faces without their consent, and definitely don't try to shove it down a child's throat.

                                                              youdontknowme Err... this sentence no verb?

                                                              Actually half a sentence got stuck in the output queue of my brain.

                                                              When that happens to me in German, people start to accuse me that I'm not a native speaker. 😆

                                                                  George When that happens to me in German, people start to accuse me that I'm not a native speaker. 😆

                                                                  now I have to apologize 😂

                                                                    George I personally don't have a problem with Muslims. Not the boogeyman our right wing populist try to make them

                                                                    Same here. I feel that is another case where overgeneralization can turn something from statistics to malicious discrimination. When I see people marching under a banner of their faith, it matters less whether that banner is a cross or a crescent, and more whether they are carrying pitchforks or bread baskets.

                                                                    Yes, statistically muslims are more likely to be fundamentalists with inhumane views. But the vast majority of muslims, whether practicing or not, are decent and kind people whose scariest part is what they vote for. Same with christians, and the only reason they are less likely to be bad guys is that society has actively tried to remove the bad apples from the bunch. Take a look overseas, that is where some of them ended up, and christian society in some corners of those places is not that much better than muslim society in some rather backwards countries.